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Dr. Robert Zubrin, Tuesday, 8-6-13 August 7, 2013

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Dr. Robert Zubrin, Tuesday, 8-6-13


Your Amazon Purchases Can Help Support The Space Show/OGLF (www.onegiantleapfoundation.org/amazon.htm)

 Guest:  Dr. Robert (Bob) Zubrin.  Topics:  The 16 Annual Mars Society Convention, radiation, HSF to Mars, Mars One, Inspiration Mars.  Please direct all comments and questions regarding Space Show programs/guest(s) to the Space Show blog, https://thespaceshow.wordpress.com.  Comments and questions should be relevant to the specific Space Show program. Written Transcripts of Space Show programs are a violation of our copyright and are not permitted without prior written consent, even if for your own use. We do not permit the commercial use of Space Show programs or any part thereof, nor do we permit editing, YouTube clips, or clips placed on other private channels & websites. Space Show programs can be quoted, but the quote must be cited or referenced using the proper citation format. Contact The Space Show for further information. In addition, please remember that your Amazon purchases can help support The Space Show/OGLF. See www.onegiantleapfoundation.org/amazon.htm.  PLEASE NOTE THAT IF YOU ARE ATTENDING THE CONFERENCE AND WOULD LIKE TO BE A ROVING REPORTER FOR THE SPACE SHOW WITH CELL PHONE REPORTS, PLEASE EMAIL ME.

We welcomed Dr. Robert (Bob) Zubrin back to the program to discuss the upcoming Mars Society 16th Annual Conference, Mars human spaceflight, Inspiration Mars, Curiosity, RAD, radiation levels, Mars One and much more.  For more information about the conference, visit http://www.marssociety.org/conventions/2013.  For information about The Mars Society, visit http://www.marssociety.org/home.  During our one hour discussion with Dr. Zubrin, we started our talking about the main conference speakers including Dennis Tito and Dr. Steven Squyres, among others.  In talking about Dennis Tito coming to the conference, we spent time discussing the Tito Inspiration Mars mission.  Bob had much to say about this mission, the likelihood of mission success, radiation issues, equipment and life support issues, and more.  In talking about radiation and the Curiosity RAD findings, Bob had much to say about NASA and their willingness to do a Mars HSF mission.  We took several listener emails and a call about radiation & even the use of nuclear propulsion to shorten the transit time for less radiation exposure for the crew.  Bob suggested that if we had nuclear propulsion, he would not increase the transit time (listen to his reason why which has to do with orbits & a free return to Earth), but he would increase the payload to take additional spare parts & life support equipment as he said equipment failures were a major risk factor on such a mission.  Bob talked some more about successes in the private sector, including SpaceX. He was also asked if SLS was necessary and he said he believed in more than one source for a launch vehicle and he supports heavy lift.  He also talked about the importance of government infrastructure and launch services for the future.  Don’t miss this discussion.  Later in the segment, Bob talked about the Mars Society 365 Mission (see http://ma365.marssociety.org).  Bob described this mission, why it is so important & why we should support it.  Jane emailed a question about Bob’s National Review article we mentioned, “Remembering Ploesti,” from August 3 (http://nationalreview.com/node/355074/print) and after extrapolating to today, wondered if humanity was ready for human spaceflight to Mars.  Bob provided us with an exceptional response to Jane’s question and comment so please listen and take note of what he said. I believe it to be very important.  As the program was ending, Ben wanted Bob to clarify his position on choosing either the Moon or Mars.  Don’t miss this response.  Bob left us with concluding comments to do something and support something.

Please post your comments/questions on The Space Show blog.  You can email Bob through his website or me.


1. Marcio Teotonio - August 2, 2014


I present you the human to space carrier, the never ending speed growing in no gravity space, the Engine of Levitation. This is the name of the engine, that well power the space craft. Once the space craft is in the out Space, the speed it can reach is unlimited. The speed tests won’t be possible to be done with the RCM Space Craft (the Prototype) as for this, we are going to need the real scale Space Craft piloted by a human .Obviously the ST7 will not perform this speed tests because of human resources. A bigger model will be designed later to perform deferent tasks, including the speed tests out in Space.
Its Believable that Supreme Terrestrial 7 is 10’s of generations a head from any other air craft on the planet.
This is advanced mechanical technology, that will make possible for space crafts ( man carriers), to go further than ever before.
Project’s first stage, includes, building the RC Model Craft, this well be representing the real scale space craft, and prove to big corporations the theory of the technology.
I have been working on “Supreme Terrestrial 7”. This is the name of the air craft or to space man carrier, device I have so enthusiastically working on for the past few years. This is only possible, with the Engine of Levitation, considering that the air craft is to be totally closed from any outside influence. This minds no helicopter blades, no jet turbines, no rocket engine no rocket fuel or any other kind of fuel.
This technology works totally on electricity. The engine of levitation well make possible for any object to just lift in the air like a UFO Space Ship. This minds the that “Supreme Terrestrial 7”, the triangular formed air craft, well lift in the air like an helicopter and take of like the F-16.The Engine of Levitation is capable of reaching unlimited speeds in a no gravity space, but well also reach superior speeds inside our atmosphere.
It is necessary to get the right founds, in order to build the prototype and prove to corporations, the technology works. So far no one is going to believe, that it is possible to escape gravity like this.
using the Engine of Levitation system, interacted on Supreme Terrestrial 7, making it possible to be antigravity and take off in the air beautifully. Gravity is the point of this project, I have bended its lows, creating my won gravity force field yet it’s navigation skills are as standard as it get’s

Engine of Levitation

For decades mankind has dreamed on a technology that would make possible for objects to just lift in the air like some kind of magic, but until now everyone thinks that only aliens have the intelligence to do this. In peoples head, the only place when man will match alien’s technology is on the TV with called Science fiction. That’s right; Science fiction. People don’t believe any more, that is going to be possible, to nail gravity just like that and it will probably take a long time until humans get on such level. But sometimes things are simpler than we think and all ti takes is take a look at the beginning, going bake to where everything started.
For generations man has creating and developing flaying machines that go more advanced by the day, it started on the balloon, until to today’s super military stealth’s. World wars and conflicts were the biggest factors, of the rapid development on advanced air craft engineering. But the biggest mistake of them wall was the rocket engine.
It was in Russian in 1903, Konstantin Tsiolkovskii, started the first scientific ideas on rocket propulsion. But it wasn’t until 1926, when an American engineer, Robert Goddard, launched the first rocket in to the out in Space. Whoever, I would never agree on people sited on top of a bomb, in order to go to space.
In my opinion, NASA must be respected not only for the brave astronauts, how sadly lose their lives in mission, but also for the impressive piece of engineering designed air craft; the Shelter. I admire its tuff insulation presiders. But; with that said, were will this devise take us, once you are in the out in space.
The two day’s Space craft’s use a lot of energy just to pass over the atmosphere. They are complete money burners, and that well make a super budget obligation, to support any space project we might have in mind. But the point is that, after in the out space, they don’t really take you no were, apart from just orbiting the planet, or no further than the Moon, in terms of man carriers. Please don’t get me wrong, it is a very respectful stage, it does take a lot of effort to get there, but we have been in this stage for too long.
Way not just lift in the air, like an UFO Space Ship at any speed we desire? Way having tonnes of liquid fuel on a Space Ship only to generate enough trust to lift itself in the air? Does mankind pretends to reach other galaxies, abducting such ways of traveling into Space? Do they really want to spend over a sentry building a super Galactic Space Ship in the out in space, at the size of stadiums, with gigantic combustion chambers and millions of tonnes of fuel to see if they might reach light speed, after a several years of taking off period in order to get to other Galaxies? Wouldn’t a project like that must probably and up in disaster, without considering the high risk assessment? Doesn’t mankind want’s to finally find out what else is out there, and if we are really alone in the Universe? Or they really think we are the only planet with life, in this solar system, and the other billions of stares around us are just stares?
Yes we can just lift in the air at any speeds we desire; no, we are not going much further in space abducting such rocket primitive ways, so we must skip the rocket; and we are definitely not alone in the Universe.
We waited too long for this. It’s Time to Embrace the Future, this is the next big move in Aeronautics, and right now no one is closer to Land on Mars, or further. After years of intense studding and research I am now on a blink to make it happen.
It started years ago, looking at the stars of course, and wondering what else is out there? And how will I ever get there? According to what we learn in schools, and what the world chows us, it’s simply not possible. But I never believed in it, so I ignored mankind education and dropped all believes I had against the possibilities of travelling further in Space and so I started making my own way.
I know that I would have to escape Earth’s gravity, escape wall the Atmosphere layers and really considering the Thermosphere, the must dangerous of them wall. The top of the Thermosphere is about 450 km(280 miles) above the Earths, is the hottest layer, as the few air molecules absorb radiation coming from the sun. Temperatures will reach as high as 2000 degrees C at the top.
A space ship must reach 40.000km/h (24,840mph), the escape velocity, in order to get out of Earth’s gravity and in to Space. But once in the out is space we still have to face hush environments, like ultra-violets’ from the Sun and extreme temperatures. So far things didn’t look good for me, so I went bake on research and only kept the information that could be used.
So I started the antigravity standing, to create the Engine of Levitation. It was very hard at the beginning with too many dead ends. Things didn’t stared going very well bake than, with a lot of struggles and false theories. But as time pass by I got closer to master this system and bit gravity. It was just a matter of time before I have finally conquered; and I did.
Today I am the founder of the Engine of Levitation, and I don’t support Science Fiction. If you thought, you would never live to see this day, you were wrong. This is wright here and wright now, waiting for founds to make its first move, representing the unlimited step for wall mankind.
Considering the leak of communication between me and big corporations, meaning they’re ignorance towards me; they still spend billions on space devices incapable of taking man further in the out in space and this kind of projects, often take years.
Don’t they want what I have? It doesn’t look like, because wall I had from them were rejections. Eventually I will end up completing the project. Once you design something like the Engine of Levitation, on your own and without any founding help, you feel invincible, you fell like f***** superman, capable of doing anything; £ and 13 months, that’s all it takes for me to rise Supreme Terrestrial 7 in the sky’s. Obviously I would charge £17.4 billion just to build it myself under a contract, considering that I am the only entity on planet that can build it and because the ST7 is worth a lot more than that.
It is a lot easier to explain how the Engine of Levitation works than to design it. This system creates its own force field, generating trust and forcing the object upwards against gravity. Its Power will manage it to create enough trust in order to lift more that its own weight, there for the reason why it can be interacted on an object, making it this way, a flying object. In fact it will create so match trust that if speed box is not correctly calculated it will take of like a bullet. In real scale air craft, this kind of take-off trust would generate more than enough G-force to kill a human been. But knowing that this system works on a rotating motion, having electricity as the energy source, it’s easy to have an adjustable speed box, there for is powerful but safe.
The ST7 will incorporate five cylinders powered by four engines. The cylinders are simply part of the Engine of Levitation system.
One cylinder will be positioned on the front of the ST7; it’s called the Will Cylinder. This cylinder is the weal of the ST7; it pulls it to any direction assisted by hydraulic power units. The Will Cylinder will also help the two cylinders positioned on the back corners of the ST7; to generate trust in order to lift the craft in the air. These two cylinders are called the Trust Cylinders 1 and 2; they will also pull the ST7 forward, assisted by hydraulic power units, in order to help generate extra speed.
The other two cylinders are called the Light Cylinders 1 and 2. They are slightly longer and they are the responsible for speed, assisted by the other cylinders for same task. The Light Cylinders have a solid position, laid on the bottom pointed towards the front of the ST7.

Supreme Terrestrial 7 Body Shape
& Military Capabilities

If you see the body of the ST7 in real life; you would think that it is impossible for it to rise in the skies. You would think that way because, according to human tech-records, such technology doesn’t exist. Its body doesn’t require any helicopter blades, no jet turbines and has no entrance for turbo fans. It’s a complete closed triangle, and very well insulated for face Space tuff environments. Its triangle shape will make the ST7 to cut the air like a knife and reach superior velocities in shorter periods of time. It will also cut on top of water and go under it, because the ST7 holds more than enough insolation and the navigation technology to do it. The ST7 will easy go under the radar, according to its flouting capabilities in the air, at low speeds.
Supreme Terrestrial 7 it’s not half as noisy like the today’s air craft, how will make any one deaf just to lift them self’s in the air. Further soundproof research might be done, to insulate the engines, in order to make it completely silent. But as a construction builder myself, I already know what materials to start exploring. But the fact is that the ST7 is almost silent and at short distances you will simply not hear it, but it will be there like a ghost, completely stopped and flouting in the air, staring right at you.
ST7’s lower body shape will straight itself, as it renters the atmosphere. The top is almost flat to protect cockpit as it renters the atmosphere.
The body of the ST7 will be protected with carbon-carbon on top of flat titanium and this way, considering its speed it can escape the entire Earth’s atmosphere. The body must have capacity to take the hit of the thermosphere. This tuff fourth lair of the atmosphere will not melt, but boil iron.
St7’s two separated and insulated body compartments on the far back corners, can be used to deploy stealth target missiles, or even WMD’s. According to its trust capacity, such weight can be lifted, there for you are probably starting to realise how serious this technology is. The ST7 in the wrong hands would be a disaster.
Have I told you, that I can interact the Engine of levitation in a missile? Yes it can be done with a smaller model of the engine of levitation. The ST7 wasn’t designed for destruction, it was designed to travel further in Space, but its military capabilities are limitless.
A primary attack from the ST7 would probably be from the above, outside the atmosphere, completely in the out in Space, this way the ST7 is completely or 100% untouchable by any other weapon on the planet. No technology on Erath is prepared to face Supreme Terrestrial 7’s striking power.
If you think that the premiere weapon of stealth is the missiles you are wrong. The main weapon of stealth is not its fire power but its abilities to go under the enemy radar. However, the ST7 needs no such thing. It can be invisible under the enemy’s yeas, but even so, it will be unstoppable on any strike being executed by it.
The only thing capable of stopping the ST7 would be another ST7. If you have an ST7 as the enemy and you don’t have another one yourself, you are in deep s***! But even if you had one, you would be depending on combat statistics once the two ST7’s are engaged, considering the performance in both pilots. This stealth has the power to crush an empire without the risk of having a scratch. Supreme Terrestrial 7 will be the most powerful flaying entity to ever cross the skies of the Earth; it must never fall onto the wrong hands.
There is something extra to put on Supreme Terrestrial 7 body. With the right hardware it could be the yeas from the above (out in Space) to detect any strikers, like stealth’s, WMD’s etc. and stop these under time of their strike impact. But further research might be needed, however this is extra. If we had such hardware, and if we could find the way to recharge the batteries within the space craft, this product would become complete.
Is it a boat? Is it Stealth? Or is it a Space Ship? You may ask these questions when you see its body shape in real life, but know this; Supreme Terrestrial 7 is all of these in one, with no room for error.

(by Founder of the Engine of Levitation: Marcio Teotonio)

Dr Zubrin, pls see what this is and let’s score this mother open!

2. The Space Show - August 7, 2013

I would like to respond to Jim’s comment about callers. I 100% agree with you Jim but its a harder problem to solve than what you suggest. First, if a caller is using a cell phone, until they pause their talking, they cannot hear me due to the lack of full duplex. My choice then is to terminate the call or wait for the caller to pause. Next, I am pretty sick of callers doing their own version of a lecture, speech, or thinking they are the guest. I ask for succinct questions and calls and it is as if nobody knows what the word means. It is frustrating. Callers, why can’t you be succinct in your comment or question? If there is a reason you must deliver a speech or lecture, I sure would like to know it! I am going to mention this again on the next OL show but I guess the only way to enforce it is to terminate such a call. Also, some listeners are using cell phones with really bad audio. Dave’s call last night was such a call with horrible audio. I could understand him most of the time so I did not drop the call based on bad audio, but I came close to doing so. Bob did have a problem at times understanding what Dave was saying and this was because of the lousy audio with Dave’s phone line. In the end, I want listener phone calls and dialog but I don’t want listener lectures and speeches and listeners have to have good audio. I’m ok with listener exchanges with the guest, they don’t have to hang up immediately upon asking their question but speeches and lectures are not acceptable. The question or comment needs to be put forth promptly. Listeners, those of you doing what Jim talked about in his comment, you are helping me to decide to just terminate your calls. That is not what any of us want but Jim is right, hijacking the show with long listener speeches and disconnected, rambling questions is not good for the guest, for the show, or any of us. Please, be succinct in your questions and comments. Use a quality phone line that produces good audio. If you don’t have good audio, send an email instead. By the way, many of you send very long email comments and questions. If I have time to edit them on the fly so to speak, I do that. If I can’t, I ignore the email. That’s all.

Thank you for helping to make The Space Show an even better program.


3. Jim Davis - August 7, 2013

Zubrin is a blue chip guest; all his Space Show appearances are worth listening to whether one agrees with his positions or not. He is very articulate and argues his positions very well.

That said, I have problems with two things he said. The first was comparing Everest climbers to the Mars One volunteers and suggesting that refusing the latter permission to launch would be “the abolition of freedom”. Although sympathetic to the spirit of his point, I think the comparison does not hold water. If Everest climbers were in danger of becoming trapped on Everest and billions of tax dollars became necessary to rescue and/or support them the relevant governments probably would forbid any Everest attempts and I doubt many people would have a problem with it. The issue with Mars One is not that they might necessarily die suddenly but that their plan might involve people being trapped on Mars and facing certain death unless a great deal of government money is spent keeping them alive. I think governments are well within their rights to be concerned about space colonists becoming burdens to the state. Indeed, cynics might suggest that the Mars One plan secretly is just that – to get people to the surface of Mars and use emotional blackmail to get governments to keep them alive.

The second thing I have a problem with is the issue of a 100 million people who could finance a Mars mission with donations. The X-prize Foundation failed to raise the $10 million prize and had to resort to taking out an insurance policy. I think Zubrin (typically) vastly overestimates the enthusiasm for Mars.

Lastly, I again urge the host to be more diligent about callers hijacking the show like the caller about nuclear thermal propulsion did. The caller was well into a lecture on the subject and would probably still be talking if Dr. Livingston hadn’t finally interrupted him. It’s clear the caller had no intention of asking a question but wanted to take over the role of guest. Dr. Zubrin managed to salvage the situation by making a good point about the free return problem that fast transits face. Dr. Livingston should not let callers blather on like that and insist they ask a concise question.

Trent Waddington - August 20, 2013

1. No government is going to “rescue” or even resupply the hypothetical Mars One colonists, should anyone ever go to Mars and get stranded there. That’s just a stupid argument

2. The X-prize Foundation did *not* take out an insurance policy. They looked into it, but it was too complicated. The Ansari’s provided the entire prize pool. That’s why they called it the Ansari X-Prize.

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