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Classroom with Drs. John Jurist & Jim Logan, Tuesday, 12-17-13 December 16, 2013

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Classroom with Drs. John Jurist & Jim Logan, Tuesday, 12-17-13


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Guests:  Dr. Jim Logan, Dr. John Jurist.  Topics: This was a Classroom show on radiation issues for deep space travel, Mars and Moon settlements.  Please direct all comments and questions regarding Space Show programs/guest(s) to the Space Show blog, https://thespaceshow.wordpress.com.  Comments and questions should be relevant to the specific Space Show program. Written Transcripts of Space Show programs are a violation of our copyright and are not permitted without prior written consent, even if for your own use. We do not permit the commercial use of Space Show programs or any part thereof, nor do we permit editing, YouTube clips, or clips placed on other private channels & websites. Space Show programs can be quoted, but the quote must be cited or referenced using the proper citation format. Contact The Space Show for further information. In addition, please remember that your Amazon purchases can help support The Space Show/OGLF. See www.onegiantleapfoundation.org/amazon.htm.

We welcomed Dr. Jim Logan and Dr. John Jurist to this special 2.5 hour Space Show classroom in-depth discussion on space radiation. We focused our discussion on deep space, Mars, the Moon and BLEO missions. Note that on both The Space Show blog (see above) and The Space Show Classroom blog (http://spaceshowclassroom.wordpress.com),  Dr. Jurist has a Power Point presentation on radiation.  During the program, our guests referred to specific slides that you will want to check out.  In our first segment, Dr. Logan started out by telling us about his interest in the subject, why he has been writing a paper on the subject for publication, and how this Classroom show came about.  He cited our short duration spaceflight experience, the Apollo missions, Space Shuttle flights, and then how things started to change when we had six month ISS visits.  Dr. Logan also made it clear that space was not a benign emptiness type of environment.  He said the reality was that interplanetary space was a sea of disruptive ionizing radiation wrecking havoc on biologic systems.  We moved forward in our discussion from that point.  We talked about the findings of the MSL RAD instrument regarding radiation on the way to Mars and on the surface of Mars.  Both John and Jim spent some time putting the RAD numbers through analysis to let us know what this means for human missions to Mars.  We talked shielding, possible materials, passive and active.  We talked extensively about water and the use of hydrogen as well for shielding.  Our guests addressed the two types of radiation, the GCR (galactic cosmic rays) and the CME/solar flare.  Here, John suggested listeners look at his slide 13 as we talked about protons and neutrons.  Jim said there was no magic bullet and talked about shielding effects of Earth’s atmosphere.  Pay attention here as Jim introduced us to the  RP scale.  For being on the surface, he said nothing less than RP100 would suffice.  For the vehicle, an RP5 was required.  John introduced us to career limits for radiation for men and women astronauts of different age but the career limits are for LEO and not BLEO.  BLEO limits are expected to be more restrictive when made public in April 2014.  Earth Mars transit times were discussed, especially in the context of Brian’s email that suggested a 180 day transit time.  Both our guests said that was unlikely with chemical propulsion and all of us again stressed the need for nuclear thermal propulsion.  Microgravity was talked about, especially in the context of side effects due to the radiation environment.  Jim then brought up the EVA subject and spacesuits.  Briefly, Jim said that quite possibly the ISS construction represented the zenith of EVAs which may become a thing of the past.  Don’t miss why he said this plus his description of serious spacesuit limitations.  We talked about life support to Mars and here Jim suggested we should use Open Loop! Again, listen to the rational behind this recommendation.  Don’t miss what our guests said about theories & movies making it sound easy to go to Mars and that the radiation would be nothing more than just a few more cigarette packs a year.  Our last topic addressed informed consent issues.

In the second segment, I asked our guests for a readiness timetable were there sufficient funding and technology advancements.  I also inquired if Russia, China, and others assessed the radiation risks in a similar way to the U.S.  We then talked about radiation and space pregnancy, fetus development, birth, and informed consent for the fetus, a baby, and a child under 18.  Ethical issues regarding child birth and space pregnancy were talked about as well.  Curt had sent in email questions which our guests answered, especially about drinking irradiated water and microgravity DNA damage & what this may mean for radiation effects.  Next, I asked Jim and John to tell us their 2-5 steps for the start of designing a Mars human mission.  Jim went first and listed Day 1 and Day 2 activities, John listed his top three priorities which were different than those suggested by Jim.  Don’t miss this discussion as its very instructive as to how to do or at least start mission planning for a human mission BLEO.  Roger sent in a question asking if the crew should be senior citizens since they have more resistance to radiation.  Don’t miss what our guests said about this idea.  It may surprise you.  Our next topic was would going to Deimos be easier.  Yes, it would but it would be a very different kind of human  mission.  Jim had some great comments about Mars gravity.  Briefly, he said it was the “best.” Later, when asked to compare the Moon and Mars, our guests said lunar radiation was worse than Mars.  Also, the Mars atmosphere does provide limited shielding while there is no such thing on the Moon.  Jim had earlier talked about a sphere being the perfect shape for an interplanetary spaceship.  Shelia emailed in wanting to know if heavy lift made a difference and if the sphere was so good, why were capsules being used? Don’t miss the response.  We then talked about the complexities of rendezvous and docking, especially in the context of fewer launches (heavy lift) as compared to many more launches (smaller rockets).  Near the end, I asked our guests if either thought our nation, the public, NASA, our leaders and politicians were sufficiently motivated to do a human Mars mission.  Jim did not think so and had much more to say in reply to this question.  John was more pessimistic.  Both thought it was more likely that the private sector would mount a human Mars mission rather than our seeing a government mission, but raising the needed capital might turn out to be a show stopper.  The three of us then talked about what it was like growing up in the 40’s, 50’s, and 60’s as compared to today.  John and I (John is a bit more than 2 years older than me) were probably more harsh than Jim in our assessment of today, but we all realize that the younger generations will be taking us to space, building the next smartphone and more. I talked about my visits to Google, Apple, SpaceX, etc. and the excitement in the air in belonging in their work forces which does not seem to exist with NASA. This opened the door for Jim to put it on the line about his NASA experiences and the potential opportunities providing NASA can somehow reorganize.  He did not think the type of reorganization he was talking about would happen.  Both our guests left us with excellent takeaway points and concluding pearls of wisdom.

Please post your comments/questions on the blogs. You can reach either of our guests through me.

                                                  Radiation Biophysics and Human Spaceflight

Dr. Edmund Storms, Friday, 1-18-13 January 19, 2013

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Dr. Edmund Storms, Friday, 1-18-13


Guest: Dr. Edmund Storms.  Topics: Low Energy Nuclear Reactions (LENR) updates, cold fusion theory and more.  Please direct all comments and questions regarding Space Show programs/guest(s) to the Space Show blog, https://thespaceshow.wordpress.com. Comments and questions should be relevant to the specific Space Show program. Written Transcripts of Space Show programs are a violation of our copyright and are not permitted without prior written consent, even if for your own use. We do not permit the commercial use of Space Show programs or any part thereof, nor do we permit editing, YouTube clips, or clips placed on other private channels & websites. Space Show programs can be quoted, but the quote must be cited or referenced using the proper citation format. Contact The Space Show for further information.  We welcomed back Dr. Edmund Storms to update us on progress being made in the field of cold fusion (Low Energy Nuclear Reactions or LENR).  Websites of interest relating to this discussion are www.lenr.org, http://research.missouri.edu/iccf18/index for the upcoming University of Missouri ICC18 LENR conference, and www.ecatworld.com.  Dr. Storms started out with a brief summary of the cold fusion research history through current times, including the latest on the Andreas Ross E-Cat device.  He had much to say about Rossi’s E-Cat, explaining why he thought Rossi had a “tiger by the tail!”  We discussed LENR work around the world as many scientists, engineers, and nations are working to make LENR replicable and to fully understand the theory by which cold fusion works.  Evidently, there is still not a good understanding of the process.  Dr. Storms talked about the need for a proof and said much more information was needed to make sense of it all.  Dr. Storms also mentioned that the U.S. Patent office typically does not grant patents in this area though there have been a few exceptions over the years.

     In the second segment, Ricardo called and mentioned that today the European Patent Office had granted Francesco Paintelli a patent on his LENR process.  You can read about this patent at www.e-catworld.com/2013/01/european-patent-granted-for-francesco-piantellis-lenr-process. Pooley sent in a note about gamma rays & neturons and said that did not apply to LENR but understood the difficulty traditional science had in understanding this fact.  Dr. Storms discussed the patent and this process, then talked about the upcoming University of Missouri ICC18 LENR Conference in July 2013 (see the above URL).  During this segment, we talked about the criticism levied at LENR research by other scientists, institutions, and sometimes governments.  We talked about funding issues, the challenges for LENR to get traditional funding through grants from government and academia, and the fact that most LENR funding comes in from private sources.  Dr. Storms provided us with some comparisons to the LENR research process, one being the perfection of the transistor. It’s a fascinating story you will want to hear.  Near the end of the program, Dr. Storms talked about his plans to change his research focus depending on the success of LENR research in 2013.  He connected the dots with the U.S. and global economic problems to R&D investment from all sources and explained to us how that was influencing his own future research plans.

     Please post your comments/questions for Dr. Storms on The Space Show blog above.  You can email Dr. Storms through me.

Dr. Edmund Storms, Sunday, 1-8-12 January 8, 2012

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Dr. Edmund Storms, Sunday, 1-8-12

Cold Fusion/LENR


Guest:  Dr. Edmund Storms.  Topics:  Cold Fusion or Low Energy Nuclear Reactions (LENR) today.  You are invited to comment, ask questions, and discuss the Space Show program/guest(s) on the Space Show blog, https://thespaceshow.wordpress.com.  Comments, questions, and any discussion must be relevant and applicable to Space Show programming. Transcripts of Space Show programs are not permitted without prior written consent from The Space Show (even if for personal use) & are a violation of the Space Show copyright.  We welcomed Dr. Edmund Storms to the program for a nearly two comprehensive discussion on LENR or as it is more commonly referred to, cold fusion.  Dr. Storms started us out with the history of cold fusion dating back to Pons and Fleischman on through to today.  He also explained why there is now a renewed interest in the field.  Jumping forward to today, Dr. Storms talked about Andrea Rossi and his E-Cat cold fusion device and demonstration, plus his special reactor units.  For more information, check out these sites: www.lenr.org, and the YouTube sites listed here:  www.lenr-canr.org/news.htm.  While Dr. Storms provided us with the basics, it was his response to listener questions and phone calls that allowed us to dig deeper into the potential of LENR.  Our program was devoted to exploring, understanding, and evaluating where the LENR field is today and what risks and challenges lie  ahead before the observed phenomena is understood and can be commercialized.  Dr. Storm talked about being able to replicate science but often in the early days when the research is not well understood, replication might be challenging.  He also talked about the difference with scientific observation of experiments and scientific replication.  Several of the listeners and callers went into detail with Dr. Storms. For example, John’s call from Atlanta inquired about quantum tunneling. Charles R. called in a few times with very technical questions, including asking about the Widom-Larsen Theory Portal (http://newenergytimes.com/v2/sr/WL/WLTheory.shtml#4step).  In the second segment, our friend Charles Pooley called in as a skeptic to debate cold fusion as being real, dismissing the observations and research across the board.  I know you will find this short “debate” interesting. Throughout the show, listeners wanted to know about the potential application and use of a Rossi device in the U.S., both in our homes or as part of the power supplied by utility companies.  We also talked about the broader uses for cold fusion in the less regulated third world.  In the second segment, our guest was asked about Andrea Rossi and his track record, plus his effort to commercialize, patent, and sell Rossi devices.  Later we talked about funding opportunities for LENR research, the lack of available funding from traditional sources such as NSF, and the paradigm shift required from traditionalists to realize that cold fusion may involve different processes from the well understood nuclear reaction process.  In fact, you will hear several listeners resist seeing this in a vastly different light and we talked about this during our program.  As you will hear, much research is needed to understand cold fusion and to validate its potential, especially its commercial potential. At this time, there is good research being done by credible scientists.  When asked what we should look for, Dr. Storm directed us to follow the reviewed literature and news accounts on www.lenrr.org and the links provided on that site.  This brief summary only touches upon what we discussed today.  Post your comments and questions on The Space Show blog URL above.  You can also follow the contact instructions on http://www.lenr.org.


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